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Apocalypton Profile
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Caped Crusader
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Registered: 02-2004
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Re: Kevlar® Armor Your Cowl


JCG: :mail
It's not important that the molding cowl is a different design from the worn cowl. My two were different, but the basic designs are close enough for making interchangeable armor elements. Also, I'm having my cowl armor elements molded so as to be able to provide e-K castings to a few interested Bros, saving a lot of work.

Alex: Keep those pics comin' Bro!

Zane


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As a symbol, I can be incorruptible. I can be everlasting.
9/14/2005, 1:34 am Link to this post Send Email to Apocalypton   Send PM to Apocalypton
 
Jants Profile
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Re: Kevlar® Armor Your Cowl


 :applaude to ya Zane.. aka Macguyver of the BOTB.

When we first kevlared (is that a word hehe) the nipples Panther torso, I pulled it and threw it on and was messing with my old roommate. I told him to punch me in the abs, he thought it was a rubber torso, like most of my armo,r and wailed away.. he hurt his hand and I didn't feel a thing. That;s what he gets for trying to punch me so hard. I'm such a jerk. :)

---

9/14/2005, 1:44 am Link to this post Send Email to Jants   Send PM to Jants
 
Lewis Tully Profile
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Caped Crusader
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Re: Kevlar® Armor Your Cowl


Well, Zane, I am definitely an interested Bro... If that comes thru, let me know...

 :up

JCG

---
"What does that mean?"

9/14/2005, 9:39 am Link to this post Send Email to Lewis Tully   Send PM to Lewis Tully
 
Apocalypton Profile
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Caped Crusader
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Re: Kevlar® Armor Your Cowl


Yeah Jants, Kevlared! Love it - you PROVED the Joker hurt his hand in the belfry, not to mention our fooling around with that e-K Robin chest. Really pick up on how you go for new directions.

JCG: It's gonna happen, Bro - with the trick being getting enough scarce Kevlar.
 :cheers guys,
Zane


---
As a symbol, I can be incorruptible. I can be everlasting.
9/14/2005, 9:52 am Link to this post Send Email to Apocalypton   Send PM to Apocalypton
 
peterparker0077 Profile
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Apprentice
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Re: Kevlar® Armor Your Cowl


I'm sorry for being a negative voice in this thread, but I just dont want anyone to get hurt trying things to test that armor. The inserts you put into the cowl would not stop any bullets or safe you from even a motorcycle wreck. In fact they would not even work against a simple punch to the head, it would feel as if you didnt even have it on, and you would still be knocked out just as easy. You may not want to refer to the cowl as "functional" because it really isnt (aside from the radio, which is really cool.)Please be safe and dont try anything silly.

Again, I hate to be the negative one, but as an engineer who knows this stuff, I feel its my responsiblity to let you know. I also am a martial arts instructor and haved worked with 2 different martial art pad producers on head gear designs, testing and such.

Don't get me wrong, its really cool stuff, but think that it will actually protect your head.

Be Safe! I'd hate to hear a news flash on CNN about some one trying to be like batman and getting hurt or even killed.
9/15/2005, 5:01 pm Link to this post Send Email to peterparker0077   Send PM to peterparker0077
 
shadowsensei Profile
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Re: Kevlar® Armor Your Cowl


I love the file you sent me Zane-Thanks a-lot bro. As for being bulletproof- nobody claimed as much, this just being more than a "costume" piece. Hopefully no bro's here would do anything silly because they had a kevlar lined suit. I have been both a martial arts instructor as well as a tactical shooting instructor and would not think to dress in my batsuit to fight crime. I'm praying that there is not dillusional bros here making a suit for just that pupose. It's meant as a optional upgrade to the normal costume suit. Purely a WOW factor. At least I hope everyone here knows [sign in to see URL] again Zane-I enjoyed the file!

---
There is something out there in the darkness...Something terrifying...Something that will not stop untill it gets revenge...
Me!
9/15/2005, 6:21 pm Link to this post Send Email to shadowsensei   Send PM to shadowsensei
 
Apocalypton Profile
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Caped Crusader
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Re: Kevlar® Armor Your Cowl


1. Well said, Shadowsensei, and especially eloquent. Yours truly is also on record all over BOTB, LOH, and BTM about the foolhardiness of trying to be a "real" Batman. This thread, for example:

[url][sign in to see URL]

2. Nice to have Peter/Chris’ encouragement with cowl devices that pose no safety issues. Regarding armor, there’s never harm in healthy caution and skepticism, with questions better than presumptions and leaping to unsupported conclusions.

3. These particular e-K inserts would not stop bullets, due to reduced thickness rather than e-K armor in general. Available cowls are just too small for heavier inner shielding. On punches, I’ve rapped my head and Brin’s with these armor elements in place, and we felt nothing. But that’s no endorsement to use a baseball bat. And even if thicker e-K prevented bullet penetration, which it has in laboratory, military and anecdotal tests (per threads below), I’m also on record regarding the likelihood and dangers of fractures and organ trauma, and it’s good to see Bros’ sensible posts on this.

4. Bell, among other manufacturers, makes Kevlar motorcycle helmets. Imagine wearing one and getting hit without the internal padding, which is about the best a large enough cowl could do with thick e-K armor or coating an e-K helmet underneath. And if padding were added, how big would the cowl have to be?

5. BOTB has bantered functioneering for some time. My own first "Functional Bat Suit" thread was on Ezboard’s BOTB on 3/3/03. 31 different Bros responded, with 28 positive or neutral and 3 negative. Since that time 2 of the 3 negatives have come to encourage functional approaches, with one now happy to have his own e-K lined chest – and he’s not trying to be Batman. On 3/4/03, Peter/Chris wrote: "yeah cool suit. but I do see it ending badly too, I hope no one tries to really stop a bullet. I am interested what type of kevlar and what structure of kevlar you used. I am an engineer and know that it takes alot [sic.] more than just kevlar to stop bullets, or else the whole army would be bullet proofed by now." Various threads, including those linked below, have since answered his Kevlar questions.

6. State licensed engineers must be prepared to sign plans and specifications where people’s safety and lives can hang in the balance in the event of errors – and major liability and deep remorse go along with serious enough errors. So Peter/Chris’ concerns and misgivings regarding safety are part of the profession and are to be respected. That said, his assumptions and reasoning on any subject are just as open to scrutiny and question as anyone’s. For those curious or interested in checking some history, below are a few links.

On validation of e-K bullet-resistance (replaced with Archive thread added by edit, down further):

[sign in to see URL]

Bullet-resistance and grappler motor challenges and responses:

[sign in to see URL]

Zane’s original [sign in to see URL] BOTB Functional Gearmotor post:

[sign in to see URL]

Engineering Grappler Contest Page 1 (with conclusive horsepower proof calc shown on Page 3):

[sign in to see URL]

Finally, all are welcome to PM yours truly with e-mail addresses, should anyone be interested in mutually exploring Bat Suit functioneering in greater depth than on board threads.

"In the meantime, might I suggest you try to avoid landing on your head?"

Zane

ADDED BY EDIT
Archive Armor thread:
  
[sign in to see URL]

More on armor and grappler:
[sign in to see URL]

[sign in to see URL]

[sign in to see URL]

[url][sign in to see URL]


Last edited by Apocalypton, 9/16/2005, 11:36 am


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As a symbol, I can be incorruptible. I can be everlasting.
9/16/2005, 1:38 am Link to this post Send Email to Apocalypton   Send PM to Apocalypton
 
peterparker0077 Profile
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Apprentice
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Re: Kevlar® Armor Your Cowl


Great post shadowsensei and Apocalypton. I just get worried when topics like this pop up, and many brothers, especially young brothers, hear the word "armor" and think that they will be bullet prof. Most of us are level headed, but you never know who else is reading, many of whom do not even post.

Btw, i hope to finish that grappler design if i get more free time before oct1. Running into one snag... power, trying to get an small efficient battery that would give you more than just one ascention and decention, right now, it would take a rather large book bag to hold enough battery power. Hopefully some other brothers have given you some designs already.
9/16/2005, 9:37 am Link to this post Send Email to peterparker0077   Send PM to peterparker0077
 
Apocalypton Profile
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Caped Crusader
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Re: Kevlar® Armor Your Cowl


Thanks Peter/Chris. OT: AlfaMale entered the Grappler Motor contest with this DARPA-funded device, which uses a compact 36VDC power supply:

[sign in to see URL]
 
[sign in to see URL]|offset=30

~Z

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As a symbol, I can be incorruptible. I can be everlasting.
9/16/2005, 10:59 am Link to this post Send Email to Apocalypton   Send PM to Apocalypton
 
brunowayne Profile
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Re: Kevlar® Armor Your Cowl


What did you use for the 2-way radio and the "listening device"?

Are they easily accessible for battery replacement?

Just curious!

Thanks!

Bruno
/\M/\

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Bruno Wayne
/\M/\
9/18/2005, 2:00 am Link to this post Send Email to brunowayne   Send PM to brunowayne
 


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