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thuth Profile
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Caped Crusader

Registered: 02-2004
Posts: 1952
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Re: 89 Cowl Rear Seam


Quote:

Blackwood Bat wrote:

I already gave the reason. :lol
I'm not guessing;this is why it was done.

John :flapbat




Yeah but why 2 very different seams and other times none?
8/9/2007, 11:35 pm Link to this post Send Email to thuth   Send PM to thuth
 
Brin Londo Profile
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Keeper of the Cave


Registered: 02-2004
Location: Mississippi
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Re: 89 Cowl Rear Seam


But if this is the reason it was done, why did we just see old pics of them stretching the cowl over Keaton's head?


---
You don't choose the Bat, the Bat chooses you.
8/10/2007, 12:12 am Link to this post Send PM to Brin Londo
 
EchoSix Profile
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Caped Crusader

Registered: 08-2004
Location: Occupying Gotham
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Re: 89 Cowl Rear Seam


I wondered the same thing. I thought they were made out of latex or foam latex. Right?

Those don't stretch. Not like that, anyway.






---
"An error doesn't become a mistake, until you refuse to correct it."

8/10/2007, 12:14 am Link to this post  
 
NickDaring Profile
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Sidekick

Registered: 03-2004
Posts: 343
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Re: 89 Cowl Rear Seam


I'm betting that footage of Keaton stretching the cowl on was from coming back from a break of some sort.

If you look carefully, He's pulling his head backwards through the mouth opening and not over his head like you would to first put it on.

That being said, I too wonder why all the different variations. My best guess would be that they were able to improve the methods of construction during the production so that manually sealing up the back was no longer nessesary. It would take an annoying amount of time just to put the costume on correctly everyday, and then to manually seal up the back.

On a set, time is money and I'm sure they were eager to figure out the best way to get the actor in and out of that costume.

Maybe the original masks had to much of the power netting/ chin bracing, and cheek enhancers in them to allow for the mask to simply be pulled on over the head?

Nick
8/10/2007, 2:07 am Link to this post Send Email to NickDaring   Send PM to NickDaring
 
Blackwood Bat Profile
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Registered: 02-2004
Location: ummm...the Batcave
Posts: 6009
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Re: 89 Cowl Rear Seam


Quote:

Yeah but why 2 very different seams and other times none?


Because they were each different cowls,so no two seams are ever the same.
We've determined a few years ago there were at least three different cowl sculpts.

No seam,third time's a charm.:wink

It's probably impossible to find out at this point,but if it could determined what sequence the scenes with Batman were shot,this would answer all the questions.
Only one movie has been shot in exact sequence from the first scene to the last.
Batman isn't it.
Whatever scenes you see with the more jagged seams were shot first. The scenes with smoother seams were shot next. No seams were shot last.

Let's put it this way....if they didn't have to cut it,they wouldn't have.
There would be only one reason to cut it,and that's to get it on easier.

From what I understand,the foam they used for this movie was fairly heavy and didn't have a lot of stretch to it. The foam Dick Smith used nine years earlier for 'Altered States' was heavy as well,and it didn't change much through the years until later.
They perfected foam running as time went on,so by today's standards it's much stronger,lighter,and has more elasticity to it,so they wouldn't be faced with the same challenges.
On Batman,they were still learning as they went along.
Quote:

It would take an annoying amount of time just to put the costume on correctly everyday, and then to manually seal up the back.


It took roughly 20 minutes to put the suit on.
Almost half that time was for the boots.


John :flapbat

Last edited by Blackwood Bat, 8/10/2007, 6:27 am


---
"Wile E. Coyote is my reality,Bugs Bunny is my goal."

8/10/2007, 6:24 am Link to this post Send Email to Blackwood Bat   Send PM to Blackwood Bat
 
89Batman Profile
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Registered: 04-2005
Location: London England
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Re: 89 Cowl Rear Seam


89 cowls
The cowl on the left is Davids 89 if you look closely you'll see the seam.


---
Things change...

Even Cinderella went on 'till 12

bruceandselina@hotmail.com
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thuth Profile
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Caped Crusader

Registered: 02-2004
Posts: 1952
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Re: 89 Cowl Rear Seam


I pretty much subscribe to John's thinking, but for the sake of argument...

Do we know that the shots where the seam is visible is always Keaton in the cowl?

Maybe they are the stunt guy (Buster) who is beefier than MK and might not be able to get the cowl on his larger head, especially if it is padded in any way.

Just a thought. It might account for at least some of the visible seams.

-Tony
8/10/2007, 11:06 am Link to this post Send Email to thuth   Send PM to thuth
 
Blackwood Bat Profile
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Registered: 02-2004
Location: ummm...the Batcave
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Re: 89 Cowl Rear Seam


Quote:

Do we know that the shots where the seam is visible is always Keaton in the cowl?


I would say most definitely not.
If it was difficult to for Keaton to get it on,it stands to reason they would definitely have to slice it for the stuntman as well.

You'd also have to find out the shooting schedule for the second unit shoot.
There are whole sequences where Keaton isn't even in the shot,or just intertwined with the stuntman,ballet dancer,or whoever.
Only the closeups are Keaton.

During these shoots he probably wasn't even on the set for days until they needed him to suit up for a few closeups or walking scenes.

I just don't think the rear seam has any mysterious answer behind it.


John :flapbat

---
"Wile E. Coyote is my reality,Bugs Bunny is my goal."

8/10/2007, 7:38 pm Link to this post Send Email to Blackwood Bat   Send PM to Blackwood Bat
 
NickDaring Profile
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Sidekick

Registered: 03-2004
Posts: 343
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Re: 89 Cowl Rear Seam


I also noticed today that Howard put the rear seam on his 89 sculpt as well.

http://www.howardsstudios.com/superhero/batman/

Was a latex mask ever made of this sculpt? Luv the way it looks.

Nick

8/24/2007, 10:10 pm Link to this post Send Email to NickDaring   Send PM to NickDaring
 
Blackwood Bat Profile
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Registered: 02-2004
Location: ummm...the Batcave
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Re: 89 Cowl Rear Seam


Quote:

Was a latex mask ever made of this sculpt?


You mean Howard's sculpt?

If so,no. It actually wouldn't work as a cowl with this sculpt anyway.
His head is slightly turned to the right,so the cowl would be crooked and would not fit properly....unless you walked around with your head always looking to the right. :)

John :flapbat

---
"Wile E. Coyote is my reality,Bugs Bunny is my goal."

8/25/2007, 6:34 am Link to this post Send Email to Blackwood Bat   Send PM to Blackwood Bat
 


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